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Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg
01-05-2012, 06:41 PM
Post: #1
Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg
Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - secure_my_property_uk - 26-10-2010 08:06 PM

Any can enlighten me on my alarm. I bought this new around 2 yrs ago but dont have time to install. Last week have time to look around and installed everything with success in connection however cant manage to setup the system due to BELL TMP error. Sounder bellbox is AG6 Intellisense, did a test and all works fine. Anyone please help.. Thanks for your support.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - Rem Alarms - 26-10-2010 08:42 PM

First check the AG6 tamper switch is closing. If it is almost certainly you've wired it incorrectly. Look here; http://ukpanels.com/forum1/showthread.ph...76#pid3076
Ron.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - secure_my_property_uk - 26-10-2010 09:21 PM


(26-10-2010 08:42 PM)Rem Alarms Wrote: First check the AG6 tamper switch is closing. If it is almost certainly you've wired it incorrectly. Look here; http://ukpanels.com/forum1/showthread.ph...76#pid3076
Ron.
Thank you for your support and help. Actually I bought 2 bellbox. I tested the other one and made a research about the connection due to confusion on the circuit labeling(Bellbox & TS690r). Manage to pointed which is which on each side. I did a test as well on my panel to see if the connection is right. All the Bellbox test are successful however once it comes back to the main display, the BELL TMP error still there even though my sounder connection are successful. Please if anyone have another idea very much appreciated your help. I'm doing my best to find out how to solve this problem however I only have a small knowledge about electronics. Thanks in advance for all of your help.
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Here is my connection
BellBox(AG6) MenVier TS690r
V+ =============> H/O+
V- =============> H/O-
SW- =============> TRG
ST- =============> STB
R - =============> TR

Did a test strobe/bell/internal sounder, all work perfect on this connection. I dont know if I'm connecting this wrong or not.. a help very much appreciated. Thanks.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - engels7570 - 26-10-2010 09:48 PM

Haven't looked at any manuals to check but the wiring code looks O.K.

Check the cable from the panel to the bellbox for shorts or open circuits and double check the connections at the bellbox, ensure that there are no whiskers of wire bridging from one terminal to the next... You don't need to know anything about electronics to install a security system... thousands of people do it themselves every day.... You are doing well, keep up the good work.

Engels


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - secure_my_property_uk - 26-10-2010 10:08 PM


(26-10-2010 09:48 PM)engels7570 Wrote: Haven't looked at any manuals to check but the wiring code looks O.K.

Check the cable from the panel to the bellbox for shorts or open circuits and double check the connections at the bellbox, ensure that there are no whiskers of wire bridging from one terminal to the next... You don't need to know anything about electronics to install a security system... thousands of people do it themselves every day.... You are doing well, keep up the good work.

Engels

Hi thanks for looking on my thread and thanks for your help. Since I bought 2 of these bellbox, I made a connection wire of 5 metres directly and test the second bellbox using just a straight connection. Because as what you said it might probably just a shorted wire or disconnection on the wire from bellbox to my panel. I test the continuity of the wire and any short connection and they are all fine. However the panel still showing BELL TMP error.. Looking on my manuals but it doesnt mention anything about that error.. still looking forward on all of your help...


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - blackfish - 26-10-2010 10:21 PM

To prove whether the problem is in or out of the panel, temporarily connect a short wire between H/O- and TR- at the panel. The H/O- is a 0V going up to the bell box. The TR- is the return after it's been through the tamper switch on the bell box (i.e. should present 0V to the panel at TR-). If this clears the fault, remove the short wire and take it to the bell box. Temporarily connect the wire between V- and R-. That should be shorting out the tamper switch. If the fault can be cleared now the problem is in the bell box. If not, the problem is in the drop wire between the bell and the panel.

blackfish.
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One reference I found shows that Tamper Return (TR-) is referred to as "Bell TMP" on Menvier TS510, 700 and 900 panels. As we surmised, the panel is telling you that it is detecting a tamper with the bell circuit, i.e. lack of connection to 0V from terminal TR-.

blackfish.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - Rem Alarms - 27-10-2010 01:28 PM

Or maybe it's just waiting for a reset?
Ron.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - secure_my_property_uk - 27-10-2010 09:34 PM


(27-10-2010 01:28 PM)Rem Alarms Wrote: Or maybe it's just waiting for a reset?
Ron.
I already reset the panel 3 times but the error was still there. Since the 1st bell was already stalled on the wall, I test the 2nd one which still in box. Made a connection same as the first one using just a a straight wire(4 metres) but the error are still the same. Havent tried the connection which blackfish suggested due to time limitation that I have a the moment. The other thing that I havent mentioned was the main power connection of the panel. I'll just made a connection directly from one of the socket which I connected the wire inside the socket and put a socket in the end of it so that I can plug my panel with 13amp fuse. The manual states that a fuse spur is needed to power up the panel. Would this be one of the thing that I need to look at? Because I want to protect the panel that's why I connected it thru a socket and left it in the loft so that nobody can unplug it. Again thanks for your time and help.
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Another thing that catch my attention was the aux tamper part of the panel. On the manual it says "if its not in used they must be linked out". What does it link out means? I'm planning to connect the second sounder on that, which I wil place in the back of the house. Could this be the reason why its giving a BELL TMP error message? I look on the manual for fault finding and the list of tamper message, but BELL TMP message was not been metioned at all.. Getting crazy now...


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - blackfish - 27-10-2010 11:15 PM

AUX TMP - as you aren't using that at present, yes you must link it out (i.e. connect a short wire between these two terminals). That fits with your symptom - if the panel hasn't got a specific error message for AUX TMP it is probably flagging it up as a bell tamper BELL TMP.

As for your unorthodox mains supply, that will not be affecting the functioning of the panel but you must make sure it is safe and wired in accordance with wiring regs. If you are using a standard socket outlet instead of a fused spur, ensure that the fuse in the plug is rated at 3A or 5A, certainly not 13A.

blackfish.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - engels7570 - 28-10-2010 12:01 AM

It is a general consencus across the board in the security industry that 2amps, with 3 amps Maximum is used at the fused spur and never 5 amps. A further consencus is that a fixed fused spur is required at all times and not a mains plug under any circumstances. The control panel is regarded as a fixed apparatus in accordance with regulations.

Engels


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - Guest - 28-10-2010 12:34 AM

Hi blackfish thanks for your response. The panel definitely have a AUX TMP error message base on the list of tamper messages listed on the manual but BELL TMP it doesn't exist. Anyway when you say short wire, what do mean about it? Quiet confuse because my panel have this diagram,


AUX 1
TMP 2

AUX +
12v -

does SHORT means connect a short wire from aux1 to aux2 & aux12v to aux0v?

AUX 1
TMP 2

AUX +
12v -
thanks for help!


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - engels7570 - 28-10-2010 12:44 AM

Guest,

Before anyone says anything. NEVER put a short between Aux + and 12V -...ever..

Engels


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - blackfish - 28-10-2010 09:35 AM

Guest - Three things:

1. Please register so that we can see who's posting. We like a sense of knowing with whom we are conversing.

2. IMPORTANT - I absolutely agree with engels7570 - Fuse no greater rating than 3A and connect it via a fused spur. I had presumed that you were just lashing this panel up to test/prove it before doing a proper installation so I wanted to warn you not to connect via a 13A fuse. There are better places to have the panel than the loft, particularly because of accessibility (for you) and environment (temperature and humidity). The panel will have a tamper switch so it's not a security risk. Just put it somewhere out of sight that's convenient for wiring.

3. The two terminals that you need to link together are what you have listed as AUX1 and TMP2. At risk of confusing you, these are actually a pair of terminals for "AUX TMP" (auxiliary tamper) and just numbered as 1 and 2.
As engels 7570 says, don't short anything marked as AUX+ with 12V-. Again, read these as a pair for "AUX 12V", one being "+" and the other being "-". This is an auxiliary supply for external parts that need power. A short there is at least going to blow a fuse and at worse damage the panel (or cause a fire if you were really unlucky).

blackfish.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - secure_my_p[roperty_uk - 28-10-2010 06:45 PM


(28-10-2010 09:35 AM)blackfish Wrote: Guest - Three things:

1. Please register so that we can see who's posting. We like a sense of knowing with whom we are conversing.

2. IMPORTANT - I absolutely agree with engels7570 - Fuse no greater rating than 3A and connect it via a fused spur. I had presumed that you were just lashing this panel up to test/prove it before doing a proper installation so I wanted to warn you not to connect via a 13A fuse. There are better places to have the panel than the loft, particularly because of accessibility (for you) and environment (temperature and humidity). The panel will have a tamper switch so it's not a security risk. Just put it somewhere out of sight that's convenient for wiring.

3. The two terminals that you need to link together are what you have listed as AUX1 and TMP2. At risk of confusing you, these are actually a pair of terminals for "AUX TMP" (auxiliary tamper) and just numbered as 1 and 2.
As engels 7570 says, don't short anything marked as AUX+ with 12V-. Again, read these as a pair for "AUX 12V", one being "+" and the other being "-". This is an auxiliary supply for external parts that need power. A short there is at least going to blow a fuse and at worse damage the panel (or cause a fire if you were really unlucky).

blackfish.

Thank you for all of your help. I already asked my friend who's a certified electrician to do a connection for me on my panel. Right now everything are on the right connection. But due to his time limitation he just explain to me about my panel but not thoroughly. Anyway, thanks blackfish for your patient and supporting me to sort out my problem. I will update you about the status and hows things. By this time I'm looking to connect the other bellbox in the aux tmp connection instead of shorting it. Since that the actual design and purpose of that connection. Correct me if I'm wrong. Again thank you.


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RE: Menvier ts690r --- BELL TMP Main Panel Error Msg - blackfish - 28-10-2010 09:15 PM

Hmmm. I've never tried connecting two bell boxes to one panel though I'm sure it can be done. Some of the connections would need to be parallel but the tamper would need to be in series, and you might need to consider whether doubling the load is OK. The tamper on one of the bell boxes would need to be isolated (i.e. not have one side connected to 0V). Not quite as straightforward as you may presume. Also, the AUX TMP terminals on the panel are for connection just to a microswitch on say an external power supply unit or a remote loudspeaker. I don't know whether one of these terminals is wired within the panel to 0V (or some other potential) so I would be wary of using them indescriminately to connect to terminals on a second bell box.
Seek further advice from the experts here before progressing down that path.

blackfish.

Tell me, and I'll forget. Show me, and I'll remember. Involve me, and I'll learn.
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